Union verses Non-union

"The hooks wear out on the curve. Stress fracture enhanced by water flow and movement of slate rubbing on hook over the years and they break off."

Well there ya go, learn something new every day. I will be sure to examine the hooks I see on the next slate job.

Thanks Jed>>>

I can't answer the questions but I can offer the following commentary:

We've had 4 employees leave for the union. 3 were in drug trouble with our policy when they left. 1 was not, and left solely for the promise of bigger money. The 3 never came back. The 1 was gone for 2 weeks, came and asked for his job back. Said "I can't work with people like that. Worst attitudes I've ever seen, and the money wasn't much different after all things were considered".>>>

lol I worked up north for a while many years ago as a subcontractor. I hired this guy who kept bragging over and over about being a "union roofer". The very first day i took all the guys to a job and got them all started. Then i had to run an errand that only took a few minutes. When i got back this "union roofer" was nailing the shingles on upside down! lol I fired him on the spot as i didnt have the time ( or patience ) to train an upside down "union roofer". lol>>>

I've dealt with unions on two levels. As an employer, I had a project (2 powerhouses at dams)that required me to become a union company. My employees didn't get that much more money because I paid their initiation fees up front and then deducted them from the wages on the job. A couple of them felt cheated and quit to do work through the union. One came back to work for me after about 6 months because the amount of work they had for him was spotty. The other enjoyed being high-paid with lots of down time.

When I was in Canada in 1976, I worked for a union company. One day a guy asked me how much they were paying me. I told him and it was the same he was getting. The guy went berserk and filed a grievance against the company because I hadn't gone through the union training. This in spite of the fact I was his foreman and my output was way more than anyone else was doing. The weird thing was the same guys that were upset, still invited me to their parties and I socialised with them all the time. But after years of only doing piece-work roofing, I found getting a high salary almost like being on vacation, never having to calculate how you did at the end of the day.>>>

The hooks wear out on the curve. Stress fracture enhanced by water flow and movement of slate rubbing on hook over the years and they break off. Iv'e seen a bib "thin out" due to water flow but not worn through, it might happen but would surely take much longer...>>>

I use both bib and hook.

They each have their advantage in certain situations.

I have seen a copper bib wear through the center water line and need to be replaced.

I don't see how a copper or stainless hook would need to be replaced unless installed poorly. But I could be wrong.

Similar thoughts about union/non-union workers and employers. Seen both good and bad of both.

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I would'nt hire union if they were the last "workers" on the planet. Complete waste of rations. All I have met, and been forced to work alongside. Overweight, lazy, nepotistic thieves. Chancers. Get rid of them. They came here to our shop about four mths ago looking to recruit and I told them they would be arrested for tresspassing if they ever showed up again. Nothing against you old school. I don't know you. I do know you use a hook instead of a bib, and the only reason I can think of is a hook will need replacing one day where a bib will last for the life of the roof......

Edit: substitute "Workers" for employees.>>>

We are union, and we do roofing and carpentry too. It works for us. I wonder the same thing sometimes!>>>