The New Breed of Roofer

I've been exposed to 3 or 4 of them in the last 5 years or so. They are marketing savvy, internet savvy, they are decent salesmen. That is the sum total of what they have to offer the customer because their credentials and breadth of experience is pretty limited.

Their workmanship shows their lack of experience, the lack of knowledge that is gained only through decades of experience. They have no old roofs to show off to sell a customer, so they sell the sizzle.

Well said, Tom.

We were awarded a 3 building roofing contract for a Texas county several weeks ago. Myself and an old nemesis were the only 2 bidders. To the commissioners' credit, they entered into a 90 minute question & answer session between me and the other roofer.

The other roofer talked in platitudes, I had hard numbers. I knew the system weighs 49 lbs. per square, knew it is 144 mils wet and 72 mils dry, and knew that this is 9/64". I knew how many degrees cooler white is that aluminum, and knew that at some point that gap closes as white elastomeric is more tacky than aluminized emulsion and collects more West Texas dust. Etc, etc, etc. It went on and on and at several points it was just about to go to the other guy.

I had the numbers and the facts and I think the commissioners knew I had superior experience and knowledge of the systems involved. When the judge asked if the other guy could also install the chopped glass system we were bidding, I said "Yes, my family trained him to do it in 1989." :-)

Bob - Amen - That's got to be the most lucid way of putting it thus far..... ;)

You got that all right Bob. Sounds like this guy is now buying those exotic cars instead of selling them..... :laugh:

And Sears is getting back in the game too

I've been roofing since I was 13 that was 41 years ago. there is nothing new under the sun today then there was when I started.you got your fast talkers..that know nothing but product info.. and you got your contractors that have put in the time and know roofing. Today..it seems the quick buck is in the gift of Flash..but thats the way its always been. I worked a storm for a contractor in Southlake, Texas a few years ago..never step foot on a roof in his life..had been an exotic car salesman.He got fired and went to work for a buddy that was a roofing contractor..he decided he could be a roofing contractor..he studied product information and got a liecense.He doesnt have an office, a yard, any equipment.any employee's..has trouble finding a ladder. The point is.. he make's several hundred thousands a dollars a year.. and cant tell you why your roof leaks because he's not a roofer..he is however a capitalist. Now I will admit that this is hard for me to digest because we all get into any buisness to make a living,or to make maybe a buisness we can hand down to our kids. And we work hard..develop our craft..invest in tools and equipment..have payrolls..and are proud of every hard earned dollar..then again sometimes I wonder if my knees and back appreceiate my decisions.

A fellow I knew one time used the Ben Franklin close. He sold Kirby vacuums and 8 of them would pile into a van and hit some small town. They would sing Kirby songs the whole way there. He was the closer and would follow up after someone had done a demo. He would say "We all know that Ben Franklin was a wise man. Everytime he made a major decision he would make a list either for or against. Let's do that for the vacuum" He would prompt them for the for list, sometimes getting up to 20 items. When the against list started he would keep his mouth shut. After getting only 2 or 3 answers he would say " Well the decision is very obvious" and pull out the paperwork and get the sale. His record was 14 sales in one day at $100 a pop.

Then again there is the Ben Franklin close. B) :) :) B) Deep Down In Florida Where The Sun Shines Damn Near Every Day

You have it pegged wywoody. To reach that spot where the customer is seeking you is a sweet spot to be in.

I always got a kick out of coming in behind some slick talking salesman that was trying to sell the top of the line shingle with all the bells and wistles by doing the old cost averaging sales scam of " for only 37 cents more a day you can have the best".

Here was Grandma and Grandpa in there 80's buying a lifetime roof when in reality they were probably only going to be in their home for another five years. It was out and out sin to be targeting people like that for a lifetime roof. If they got the job they usually subbed it out to some crackhead hacks who in turn made the people's life a living hell dealing with the problems down the road.

^---This.

Unfortunately, getting your business off the ground doesn't provide much of that. Glad I don't have the problem being 2nd gen!

I tell people I'm a roofer, not a salesman. Not that it isn't obvious.

No matter how slick the presentation material or smoothly the salesman tells the customer "we're the best", you'll never get the advantages as far as pricing or relations throughout the job that you get when it's the customer telling you "I hear you're the best."

I was reading a noobie roofer's roof report once. It started out saying: This roof appears to be a gravel surfaced built-up roof system.

Appears? Well either he wasn't very sure of himself, or he thought that wording was some way to ward off legal liability later by avoiding any absolute statements. :-)

I was competing with the same guy on a job months later. When talking to the building owner I resisted telling him: Yeah, that other guy just a week ago was asking me what to do about roof blisters.

I feel some of us are honing-in on very similar sentiments/ethics - (can't capture the word I'm seeking).....

I too, don't consider myself a "salesman", what-so-ever, actually very shy, and do my best to remain as humble as possible. But then again, that's a sales technique in it's own, I suppose.

Not to make light of everyone's accomplishment, however, none of this is rocket-science. We've all used our backs/dirtied our hands as a tradesman, (some of us still at it), gone to the seminars, read the books, etc.....It all comes down to choices we make.

As an example; Upon relocating to Colorado, It probably would've been much easier to simply "do as the Romans".....I chose otherwise.

There's smooth-talking shysters & there's smooth-talking authentic individuals. My angst is derived from the ever increasing presence of the smooth talk'n shysters and today's seemingly overwhelming narcissistic public/sheep that are led to the deserving slaughter.

Very good points, Egg.

I'm not a salesman. Oh, I know all the closing techniques, I've listened to all the Zig Ziglar and Nightengale Conant sales tapes. I went through the Dale Carnegie course 6 times, once as a student and 5 times as a GA.

I know how to be a salesman, I don't want to be a salesman. I want to have the latest state-of-the-art presentation gadgets, and my roof condition reports are second to none, imo, but I don't want them to become a crutch.

I am able to sell roofs because I know what I'm doing and the customer can usually sense that. In a vacuum he may go for Mr. Glitz, but if he gives me a chance to talk about his roof, he can easily see that the other guy is a salesman, I am a roofer.

I have explained to my son a hundred times: I am not a salesman, I simply have the un-substitutable knowledge that comes from millions of sq. ft. of actual installation, and that allows me to understand the customer's needs and how to address them.

I think it's a pendulum thing. Time was when many people in this industry couldn't string two sentences together and were afraid to smile because half their teeth were gone. Then the attorneys got ahold of everything. Then the manufacturers starting glitzing. Part of it is a good thing. You can get specs and test results instantly from complex websites now. Part of it was bad. People with no practical experience modifying text, modifying specs, doing the tech writing, dealing in poorly-disguised boilerplate. Then the safety consciousness. One harness, big shoes, hard hat, eyeglasses, respirator does not a craftsman make. Standards do need to go up, but without having the floor fall out in the process. Like others on this board, I get and have always gotten a lot of work merely because I am well-spoken. That's not how I stay busy though. I stay busy because I pay attention and I love what I do and I have as much concern for other participants in business as I have for myself. I hate golden-tongued smoothies and anyone indulging in empty lip service, so I'm going to come down hard on the side of everyone in here who is griping and I'm proud to be allied in the bargain. But I remember when 90% of the workforce was Anglo and very, very sketchy, let me tell you. A mix of smooth talk and no-nonsense will win the day in the end.

Dang Tom, I wasn't aware you were a GC. That does make it tough. You need a few craftsmen that you can charge for their fees and make plenty yourself. You only need 10 - 15 of the right jobs per year, plus some supplemental 'catch-all' jobs that come along, known as 'bread and butter' jobs.

Me, I'm just a roofer and not much of a businessman. I think the most employees I ever ran was 12. That got old in a hurry. As my website says, I work alone now fixing the new work done by sub crews and specialty jobs like the one I posted about here because I was about to low ball it. http://www.rooferscoffeeshop.com/rcs/view_thread.asp?threadid=38270&forumid=8&pn= I think I was about to bid about $6K too low for the 3 squares. Still waiting on a quote or two for it.

Roofguy- I'm with ya - Have very similar experiences/sentiments.

It's a tough business. The more you know the tougher it can be. There is absolutely value in some naivety when it comes to business ventures. Sometimes we just know too much for our own good.