shingles how much$

anyone know the going rate that companies pay their shinglers in sw fl. in a down economy I figure it must be down, any one out there from sw fla :( :( :

Had a guy tell me today that the going rate for union roofing was about $270 sq. 1 layer off/ on.

Unbelievable. We must be cheaper than Mississippi

Low ball workers are what feeds me. They keep me in repair work. They're not my bane, but my job creators.

It's 17% of the HO population. Closing rate with them is 80% or higher. The '56 percent who are ‘vacillating’ are doing so because they don't understand the difference. The 17% and about 40% of the 56% who shifted over to 'price' become my best customers. The 40% underwent a costly shift when the price job had to be repaired and the installers couldn't, or wouldn't fix what they messed up. (Remember your other topic?)

Tico. All that stuff you see being done wrong is 'your' ticket. Just grin at it. :cheer: :) Check out my site in my sig and if necessary, give me a call and I'll tell you about it. Twill, it might be better than you think out there.

tinner.....17% buy on value? I've been thinking for a couple of yrs. 20% if I am in a bad mood (not closing) and 30% if in a good mood (closing).

I was close w/ my bad mood. It's worse than I thought out there...

There are a lot of people begging for some sliced chit right now. Along w/ the Storming mentality that has either screwed up everyone's heads, or made them realize just how God Awful cheep they were working for before.

Add to that the owners' watching the "News" and hearing over and over how starved people are, and it is 2 fools colliding, for sure.

Most common items I see now are tons of IKO's going on along with the usual: Terrible nailing and unvented ridge vent.

I saw a job I lost: IKO's, re-used 50-60 yr. old galvanized chimney flashing and coated the chimney cap w/ "something". I don't know what they did about venting, prolly.....not much. Homeowner did not want to add to the 3" of insulation he has.

That's the only communique' I got from him while he was deciding on what do.

Down here, low ball workers are king. Years ago in Wilmington NC I watched as my framing price got literally axed in 2. Getting 7.85-8.25 A square foot to stick frame from the curtain wall and piers to A dry in with tyvek, and all exterior openings - minus the garage door, yet had to treated wood trim the opening. These were stick built to include the roof. Then the shotguns on concrete with truss was 3.25 sq.ft. That got beat down to 2.15 sq.ft. We could frame 3 shotguns A week complete. I had 14 guys, if the roofs were up and over,or with A kick out, simple, I would piece work decks and stand alone garages to some of my top guys. My payroll, I had 1-16.00 hr. 4-14.00 hr. then the rest I had carpenters helpers and wood toters. They ranged from 8-12.00 hr. this was in 1994-97. At the end of the day with W/C, liability and tool upkeep I could make A above average pay yet never tried to break the bank. I paid about 2 bucks an hour across the board for help over other subs. I had good steady help. I guess you could say I never anticipated what would happen. We had A few hurricanes over A 3 year period,I was in Wilmington at the time. It was at the beginning of when storm chasing really exploded. Alot of the construction force that were from Texas and the mid west came, loved it, realized, with their subpar pay they could break the market. They did, and it literally shut down alot of people. I quit framing, got A barge and built docks and did remodels for my client base and did some lumberjacking. I read the article and I see, with the last few jobs ive had, selling roofs,constructions, and aluminum/shutters/windows. All of my missed sales were directly price related. I'm not bragging, yet having roofed from when so. Fl. Homes were hot and rock, decking and bucking windows,I was A tool box roof mechanic at 14 and could tie beams, buck and set windows and doors. Then built homes and pools in the Carolina's, screen enclosures and sunrooms in Miami, cut, built and installed Accordions, pavers you name it. I've built commercial centers and roofed them. Selling is mostly being able to answer all questions sensibly, excellent communication and language etiquette. I have developed this from years of selling and building what I sell. Today, at 52, just selling, with qualifiable knowledge, I lose to the cheap guys. Theirs probably A more quality conscious community somewhere,it's not here from vero beach south. I go to look over A new home here for roof or shutter work, and I shudder, theirs just so much wrong and I'm talking high end homes. I know how to look at A wall down the line, I see the flaws in alot of them as long as the stucco isnt primed yet, trusses bucking at the hangers, guys splintering fir strips and leaving them, I remember when we didn't use hat channel for Sheetrock, now it's everywhere. Don't even get me started on the concrete, I would hate to be the tile guy, especially doing price and materials. One new home would surely take 16 bags of levelor. And the contractors, along with the homeowners, they tag team for the lowest buck. Theirs only one way and that's not with quality work.

Sheeesh. That's crazy, but the client isn't the kind of person I would bother bidding for anyway. Here's an interesting article.

http://www.constructionmagnet.com/rural-builder/price-or-value-what-do-your-customers-really-want

I never get in bidding wars. When a potential client indicates he's only interested in price, I just tell them to multiply their highest bid by 4. "If you're still interested after that, call me and I'll bid."

Right now, A guy I know is doing A re-roof, tile, off / on 465.00 A square. Another job, dimensionals, 265.00. He's struggling, the company is keeping up with the new tax laws, certified payroll and such, and the biggest majority of everyone else is hiring mule jockeys. Theirs companies hiring out their labor, subs, that are as dirty down as you'd think, improper everything, help, W/C is crap certificate. They don't validate it with A fax from the carrier, and the contracting roof company could give A rats pecker, about any of it. Why? Because they are paying less than 20 bucks for tear off and dry, then another crew tiles or shingles for 20-30 bucks. The dry in includes all metal, eave, valley, flash, they have to make the extra run for primer. Oh, that 8 bucks, it was 7 the beginning of the year.

That's hard to believe $325. would be gouging. With all the insepctions, and other Fla. BS to deal with, $325. would be a bare living wage. Could do better on welfare.

tinner666 Said: Tico, did I understand you correctly? Bidding shingles at $185.?

$325. would be more in line, Id think. I only drop to $325. for hardship cases.

Tico, did I understand you correctly? Bidding shingles at $185.?

$325. would be more in line, I'd think. I only drop to $325. for hardship cases.

It's become very nouveau for south Florida contractors to transist to the storm chaser mentality since Andrew. We literally watched guys give homeowners estimates for 3 tabs at 275-325 A square. Exactimate or any other pricing system had not been defined clearly and it really made for A ruckus. We never went over 185 for 3 tab, that was because the outlets jacked up prices, and for dimensionals, we adjusted the material cost. We also had several product code snafus that we had to endure, to include enforcement issues. It was the stepping stone for storm sales people out pandering for companies also. I'm gonna go out onAlimb and say this, theirs few, if any companies down here not looking to cut every expense they can, yet not reducing the big number to the home owner. I've tried to work for A few companies. Yet it's not working. It's hard for A real roofer to pander, door knock, withor without A storm and feel good about it. Too, theirs some guys that are just money monger enough to be that ruthless. Pushing the big dollar onto the home owner, cutting out good roofers for not legal workers, using every trick in the book to circumvent the taxation and use of legal employees, all for their own sake. They also are avoiding workers comp with the cert. scandal. For those that do this, you know I'm right, you know you exist, you sell out the American dream of another to have A bigger one for yourself.

The going rate in SW FL? Hell I don't know what these nitwits pay around here even!

Maybe I should know, but every time I dive into the pool of this class of Roofers I get right back out of the cesspool and swear NEVER AGAIN!

It depends on who your paying. Your not one of them scumbags that would rather hire cheap illegals over an American are you? Or would exploit someone because they are on hard times? Also, are you still getting your market price and just looking to take advantage of others? Cause this post and your other one oozes.