Roofers Success International?????

| recently attended one of there profit days. I was wondering if anyone here has any information on them or maybe even become a member. I really like a lot of what they had to say and offer but it is very expensive. I just don't know if it is worth it or not. I have only been in business for myself for 5 years and really don't know anything about running a successful roofing business. I just see myself as great installer. I don't have any employee's I just do it all myself. I would really appreciate some help from any of you more successful roofers out there.

P.S OnARoofTop tinner666 from roofing.com said you have had membership with them and might be able to give me some advice

Chris

Flashing master Thank you? For what?

Egg, Thanks for the explaination. I took it that Kaller was not paying for the priviledge of advertizing on the site and that was/is wrong. Like I said, when I first started to read the site his ramble was in full swing and I didn't know what to make of it.

Richard Kaller was a handful. Smart guy. Very organized and mentally disciplined. The way I remember it he got himself into a wringer here ostensibly because he was not merely contributing, but also de facto touting his organization without any ante to the site as a vendor. That was deemed to be "spamming" and if memory serves, he chose to retreat from the site rather than pay for the exposure he was getting. I may be wrong, but that's what I remember. He knocked people out of joint a little because he had everything locked in and cross-linked in his methodology and not all of that agreed with opinions held by other strong personalities. He didn't seem to mind the conflict at all, rather seemed to thrive on it, and his coolness under fire was a wonder to behold. But you know, when it comes to business, no matter how you might try, you can't cut it out of the whole herd of life and treat it as if it has a set of rules entirely its own. Part of business is taking care of your health and he even stated on here that he needed some serious physical regimen and admitted he was failing to make himself keep up with it. Intellectually, he burnt down a major bridge when he tried to insist that if a contractor made a mistake in his bid, got the job, and started the job that the contractor needed to go back to the customer and impress upon them that "to do the right thing" they needed to make up the difference. He definitely lost a few people over that one. All in all, and definitely from outside looking in, I would say he had his act together and provided value. You always have to ask yourself how much knowledge is worth and whether or not you want to ferret it out on your own or pay to have it loaded on your plate by someone else. If not today, then maybe a different day. If you are in a large market and want to grow, if the jobs you seek are high-intensity demanding projects, and you don't feel in control of what it takes to keep a business from plunging off the road, then yeah, better to take advantage of several lifetimes of accumulated know-how and sophistication than wing it on a prayer. That wasn't my cup of tea and I do love tea. We are all different.

Old School Said: I dont see anything wrong with that ad I dont think that is slamming anyone.

A lot of what we do is time and Material but in a lot of cases that is the best deal for the consumer because there is more that we dont know on a lot of these projects. I tell them I can give a prive up front, but it will be higher. A lot of the time we give them a not to exceed price and then just keep track of the time and costs.

Answering the phone is a no brainer. I hate to get a message machine or an answering service, but then again, either one of them is better than nothing.

If they can make good on their promises as stated in the ad, I think they are smart and not bashing anyone. They will get business from it too!

As far as Kaller goes, I just got on the forum when he was posting, so I dont think I ever saw how it all started. He was basically telling us to charge more for our services, and suggesting ways to add Value so that we could charge even more and actually make a profit. The guys were giving him hell because as you said, I think they felt threatened or criticised because it was different than the way that they had all been running their bussinesses for all those years. Now at the same time, they were bitching because they werent making enough money and the cash flow was bad and the insurance was high and such, but they didnt want to admit that someone else might be right and that the cause of their problems was themselves.

I believe that the definition of insanity is to do the same thig and expect a different result. Dont ask me why we all fight change. Like I said earlier on this thread, IF we could all charge $1,000.00 a square for shingles installed on a walker single layer tearoff, we would all be able to take the winter off and al of us could drive new trucks and pay for them before they were delivered. DONT KID YOUSELVES, THERE ARE A FEW OUT THERE THAT DO THAT, AND THEY JUST SELL, THEY DONT INSTALL THEMSELVES. Sounds like a good gig to me!

THANK YOU! http://stealthflashingbrakes.com/

you definitely missed out OS

After reading through this post and visiting RSI's site, I've decided to sign up for one of their "profit days" in February here in Atlanta.. I will be sure to post and let everyone know how meaningful the experience is. I'm sure I'll learn more than I knew before even if I decide not to join.

TRG When I first came to this site about 5 years ago, Kaller was on the threads and he was writing on about 5 at one time defending himself. I guess I came on in about the middle of the time he was on. I thought just reading that the guys were giving him a raft of shatt without listening to him My understanding was that he was trying to show us how to "add value' to what we did and charge more at the same time. He also had a vested interest because he was talking about having the people "join" his organiation which was not fair to Vicky since he wasn't paying her for the free advertizment.

I don't really remember what the outcome was for him, but he "disappeared" never to be heard from again. I would have liked to meet him!

I went to a show in Boston,where Richard Kaller spoke,I thought the guy had some awesome insights,made the trip worthwhile

ALL advertizing is attempting to create the perception of value and urgency. Important word is PERCEPTION!.

If I can do the same thing with "sign here please" that would be a lot easier, but most of the time in the real world people are not that interested in handing over their money. I just try and treat them as I would like to be treated, and do the job for them as I would do it for myself.

WE DON'T advertize per se, but we do things exactly the way we would do them for ourselves and we tell the people what we are doing and why. It must be working because we still have work in Michigan, and as far as I know, there are very few places worse than Michigan for work right now. We are far from perfect for sure, but the simple and logical things are the things that make a huge difference in everything. Why spend a lot of money to market and to get new customers when your old customers will send you new work and new customers for free? Just treat them right and make sure to give them what you promised, when you promised, and WHEN you do make a mistake, admit it and fix it! That is how I roll.

Ya know, in a way, it is like his airing the family's dirty laundry :laugh:

I agree w/ RSI that if you pay in--- whatever amount-- and at the end of the year you have it back, plus some, then it's a good deal. I leave it at that.

I still don't like the ad. Too generalized. Man up. Be specific. Give examples....

1 Who has an answering machine? Twill? 2 Which roofer is not on time for app'ts? Is Old School like "most roofers? 3 Which roofers can't do a repair efficiently? OnA RoofTop, is he like a "lot of roofers"? 4 I'll give you a straight forward price too--and just like TTT here, it'll be way higher than what I guess the T&M charges might be. ("Roofing experts"? I've met 'em LOL) 5 WHO has concrete guarantees? Is GAK one of those "other" roofers?

Nah. Anyone could've wrote this. I'm not saying it won't work and won't be effective tho.......

I don't see anything wrong with that "ad" I don't think that is slamming anyone.

A lot of what we do is "time and Material" but in a lot of cases that is the best deal for the consumer because there is more that we don't know on a lot of these projects. I tell them I can give a prive up front, but it will be higher. A lot of the time we give them a "not to exceed" price and then just keep track of the time and costs.

Answering the phone is a no brainer. I hate to get a message machine or an answering service, but then again, either one of them is better than nothing.

If they can make good on their promises as stated in the ad, I think they are "smart" and not bashing anyone. They will get business from it too!

As far as Kaller goes, I just got on the forum when he was posting, so I don't think I ever saw how it all started. He was basically telling us to charge more for our services, and suggesting ways to "add Value" so that we could charge even more and actually make a profit. The guys were giving him hell because as you said, I think they felt "threatened" or "criticised" because it was different than the way that they had all been running their bussinesses for all those years. Now at the same time, they were bitching because they weren't making enough money and the cash flow was bad and the insurance was high and such, but they didn't want to admit that someone else might be right and that the cause of their problems was themselves.

I believe that the definition of insanity is to do the same thig and expect a different result. Don't ask me why we all fight change. Like I said earlier on this thread, IF we could all charge $1,000.00 a square for shingles installed on a walker single layer tearoff, we would all be able to take the winter off and al of us could drive new trucks and pay for them before they were delivered. DON'T KID YOUSELVES, THERE ARE A FEW OUT THERE THAT DO THAT, AND THEY JUST SELL, THEY DON'T INSTALL THEMSELVES. Sounds like a good gig to me!

Thanks! Waiting on the cake!

It's all about perception. Not many customers dig too far into the companies that they hire. A good spiel and a low price is enough for them to believe. I have a competitor who has been around for over 25 years, does evrything under the table, pays his "subs" cash, no insurance, carries an F BBB rating , has countless unhappy customers and still stays in business.

By the way, happy birthday!

I agree about RK GAK.

Yes that is a real ad. 1st of all there is a lot of truth there. 2nd of all--- & The problem I have w/ it--- is they are guilty of as many sins as anyone else when it comes to running a screwed up business. I am sure they are much better now.

I keep editing this post as it's not my intent to slam the roofing co. What I do question about RSI is if I paid them 25G's I would expect more than advice on how to slam the roofing industry & take the low road in my advertising

Tom- Is that an actual ad? It's not a bad idea.

How long ago were the Richard Kaller days on RCS? 3-4-5 years ago? I really felt bad that he was basically forced off of this forum. imho I thought that he had a lot to offer and him touting his consulting business didn't bother me at all. I think that any of these types of business can offer a lot of value if a person is ready to commit to the changes that are required. Most of us got into this trade as tradesmen. There is nothing wrong with that but often we get to a point where we need to go to another level and don't know how to do it. It would not be for everyone but it could be the answer to a lot of people. I can see the appeal. I'm sure if you asked 6 people about the RK drama you will get 6 different opinions. Mine is that he was unfairly driven off by member(s) who no longer frequent this site because he was a threat to them in some way for whatever reason. You may know who I am talking about. His posts were informative and insightful and I thought they were a valuable addition here when I compared them to what his detracters had to offer. RIP RK.