Just how fast is "fast"

Ddubya, There is no doubt that shingle to shingle you can go faster with a nailer! Day to day or hour to hour or minute to minute or literally second to second though, most people that roof now do not roof very efficiently at all. I literally cut my teeth nailing by hand, and on a crew basis, we would kick the shit out of the roofers of today. I hope that your father was/is a good roofer and that he taught you the hows and whys of doing what good roofers do. My guys have seen me hand nail and also gun shingles down. they know "how " it is done, but they still don't know how to do it themselves. It is a long learning curve.

I hate to think of it, but if there is not an improvement in quality, efficiency, and general roofing knowledge, something is going to come along and replace shingles and shingle roofing. It is almost a joke now! that is my opinion anyway. I am about to old to do it anymore and so are a lot of the guys on this forum. Give it another 10 years and we will all be gone and if we don't train others to take over, there is going to be a world of hurt, especially if the economy comes back and there is a demand for high quality work.

Now that we have a dependable supply of electricity and lithium ion batteries, we only use candles for mood enhancement. Dub, were you looking to us for some mood enhancement? :)

I'm 29 and you don't hold a candle to me, personally. Sorry to break it to you fellas. :laugh: :laugh:

I gave up the bars a couple years ago and live for/because of coffee. This part is true.

I remember when I was in high school, my Dad offered $100 to anybody on our ~8 man crew who could beat him hand nailing, while they air nailed. He lost to the challenger, but he hadn't hand nailed much in years.

OS....Good; Glad I'm not totally out of my mind....YES, most-definitely, painful to watch those guys. But that's what we have these days.

What happened? How did this huge gap occur, that productivity/efficiency slipped by?

I know how it did in the west.....cheap/Illegal/untrained, (able), workforce from south of the border.

An example; A few years ago I couldn't get my hands on a power- trowel for concrete, ("whirly-bird type machine, used to finish concrete...Takes the place of several good men)....I was told by the local Whitcap saleman, that they rarely sell them these days, as thew labor is so cheap, it's a wash.

I'm glad we cleared that up. I just couldn't fathom how nailing with a stick would improve your speed.

Thus "stick" nailing. Never heard of that before and I have been nailing for over 55 years. go figure.

I googled "roofing" again last night and it was painful to see the guys shingling on the videos. Looked like a chinese goat rodeo. So much wasted motion and people running in all idrections. Unless something changes, no one is ever going to approach anything that we used to do. We were even faster at hand nailing than most of these people are with a nail gunn. the "nailing" is certainly faster, but my God, the rest of the things they do. Not a clue what they are wasting. Time would be the biggest thing I suppose.

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---Yes, Egg has "stick nailing" described. ---To be clear...while the right hand is driving home the nail the left hand is "sticking" the next nail simultaneously. Thus, the right hand is driving home nails as fast as one can swing the hammer. The left hand is pulling a line of nails out of the stripper making the "sticking" maneuver possible. ---The left hand "sticks" the nail or sets the nail for the hammer to drive home with one swing. Instead of using the hammer to set the nail and then swing again to drive the nail home. One swing/nail. Nailing comp you must use the hammer to set the nail, move your hand out of the way and then swing the hammer again to drive the nail home. ---This becomes a repetitive action and you get into a comfortable rhythm after awhile. I never got good at it. But my mentors were very proficient and especially on the straight go could really pile on the squares. ---It is a little like rubbing your stomach and patting your head so it takes some practice. And yes, smashing your hand is exactly as Egg says. You drop a nail and hurredly try to pick it up all the while the right hand is hammering away soon to smash the lingering left hand. ---By the way this works best with 5d nails which are sharp as pins making the sticking part possible. 8d or comp nails just won't stick thus, won't work.

Lanny

Another guess is the fast ones shoot anywhere between four and fourteen nails in each shingle and see absolutely no need to talk about it. That's ok. When I was in my twenties and thirties I wouldn't have been on here either. To every thing there is a season.

Actually, I see the "problem" here. This is the roofers "coffee shop" and the younger guys would be going to the bar. Probably not many guys on here younger than 40 years old. Just a guess!

Come to think of it; I've watched some of those videos...None of them were going very fast/effecient...I had thought to myself..."these guys have no clue what fast is...LOL"....

I always found setting up a twelve hundred foot ladder to be a whole lot easier than getting it back on the truck and driving through Manhatten Island with it with all those cabbies whipping in and out, paying absolutely no attention to the lanes.

Possible, but I have seen the videos and they are mostly younger guys. Now how good they do and how efficient they are is another question. So far, all of us old er roofers have been answering.

OS.."Young" - "Proficient/fast"??? No such thing anymore....They all want to take it easy and collect a paycheck....

I was being honest. I may even finish that 1-2/3sq. copper roof I started, in Mar. of this year, tomorrow. It's been one long drawn out job.