Can I&W allow water to leak in?

I've torn HUNDREDS of roofs without it at the eaves. No problem, except maybe once or twice (?) Not sure if ever actually

Of course it behooves the mfg'ers. to upsell. No shame in that. I am good at it. But I'm honest

Problem is, it plays right into the High Volume, Low Quality work that the roofing industry is all about. How? By addressing 1) needs that don't exist 2) Treating the symptom instead the sickness

There is no money in correcting venting/ insulating problems for mf'ers and the Slash & burn contractor. If they sleep in the same bed, then....guess what?...they sleep in the same bed.

OTOH I've torn off hundreds of roofs that had issues at the eaves due to: poor carpentry, poor venting, heat loss, bad gutters, incorrect installation of starters, no overlap of shingles......did I mention POOR ROOFING? :dry:

Yes. It's primary purpose is to cover defects until the 1-2 year warranty period is over. Like I hear all the time, "It can hide a multitude of sins!" :woohoo: I use it here and there, but even if I put it down, I only consider it a possible backup in a worst case scenario. I roof over it the same way I roof over regular planks and place zero reliance on it. None, nada. :)

Look at all these houses witht he snow sitting on them. Te pix are a couple of years old, but hey all have snow sitting on them today too. None have I&W, and most, if not all of them have no felt either. http://www.albertsroofing.com/SnowGuard%20Installation.htm

As for brand, I could care less about that either. I concentrate my efforts on roofing, not underlay.

That said, it has it's place, but I still don't rely on it.

Plain Winterguard has a rough, almost granular surface. I think you need a smooth surface to seal nail holes. Grace or Winterguard HT, both of which cost about twice what the rough surface I&W can be had for.

I've found a few things that will lead to I&W leaking... 1. if it was installed over a bumpy deck, leaving voids under the I&W. it will rip in the void areas. 2. Owens Corning and any other I&W that is similar, seems to rip very easy when installing. 3. the more seams you have, the better chance of leaks. 4. unless you flash in the soil stacks, they will leak and most of them are in the outside wall closest to the eve.

As for which ones work the best, Grace on a nice flat surface, even 3 ft. pieces of EPDM works well too, and also seals best around the nails.

YES it can and will! Ice & Water shield is only as good as the fasteners you put through it. If you use cheap electro plated nails and STAPLES they will rust and the water will follow the nail holes. Also you need to install it like it was a finished roof NO HOLES, knife slips, or short laps. Lets face it Good old roofing principles are still the best practice. Shorten the coarse exposure if you insist on putting the wrong type of roof material on a low slope.

Yep it can. The only leak I ever had came on one of my first jobs after starting my business. I had maybe 6 or so years roofing experience prior to that. It was a 5 square section 2/12 roof, the rest of the roof was 6/12. The homeowner and I both wanted to shingle the whole roof 2/12 included. I bought into that crap about ice and water shield the whole thing and it will be fine, how can it possibly leak, ect. Well guess what it leaked like crazy, all over not just in one spot. I took me tearing the whole thing off and installing self adhered mod bit to fix the leaks, that's also when I learned how bad shingles stick to I+w and the tear off was a nightmare. At least I learned a lesson I guess, stick to time tested ways, not to good to be true fads like I+w being cure all for roofing.

Yup, tough problem to solve.

You can try more insualtion, more ventilation but.......

A heat cable will at least give the melt water a way through.

Condensation is a definite possibility but who knows.

Well I know there are 2x4 sloped ceilings; minimal insulation in the attic and no intake vents.

Basically unsolvable. I just question if the I&W (winterguard) can handle the on slaught of a 6" Ice Dam

OTOH.....can it be condensation from the heat loss?

Either way it's a problem that has has been 95 yrs. in the making. The way these bungalows were built, the design and assembly are truly the issues

Who knows what's in those walls....anything?...is there heat loss or a chimney effect somewhere/ somehow? A secondary concern no doubt. But really without a "no limits budget" , what are you gonna do besides count on a quality I&W?

Tough problem to solve.

3 skylights grouped there Gerry

For the most part I think I&W works pretty well. I had a call from a previous customer about water leakage on a job we did some years ago. Three years ago he had a problem in another spot nearby. We took out shingles and wrapped I&W over the fascia and that seems to have solved the problem. This time I am not sure where it's leaking from. The ice was still 3" thick up 3' from the gutter. I couldn't reach any further. So, I think the leak is either coming in at the gutter edge because the IW doesn't extend over the edge and it's getting in at the eave, OR, the ice dam is actually higher up over the height of the IW. (Right under a skylight)

Been seeing some extreme ice dam situations in the last few days. Most all of them are a direct result of heat loss into the attic. Every icicle I see is from heat loss.