They are hiring roofers

Lefty: "Like Egg said "this industry provides a guy with nothing, a way to build a good business and live a good life".

If not for all the years of working on roofs I wouldn't have the experience, knowledge and skill I have today and if I hadn't owned a roofing business of my own, I wouldn't know how to bid properly, sell at a high closing rate and how to avoid problems.

I got my start working for my father. He was a sub-contractor. Not a Roofing Company owner.

twill59 Said: If I got a shingle roofing job to do in LeHigh Valley, PA, and I wanted to sub it, how much would Holencik charge per square to the job?

No travel. Minimum specs. One layer, off/on a few vents, 2 valleys. Metal edging, pipe boots. No flashing. No dormers, dumpster or materials.

Ill go 1st: Id be at $100 minimum. If someone had dozens of these, of course it would be a little less.

If it was just me I could do it for $100 a square everything supplied. Holencik Roofing could not do it for that.

I am unclear about what you mean with the "dumster or materials". Do you mean I would supply them or the general supplies them?

I work in the same marketplace with the all of the same types of contractors you are complaining about. I have enough work to never lay anyone off because I do not concern myself with what they do. I am not trying to convince anyone in here of anything. I kept this going because I know there is at least one person that has been following this thread and will apply the things I wrote and live a good life.

I would not deny someone a good life because it does not fit my business model. Like Egg said "this industry provides a guy with nothing a way to build a good business and live a good life".

Way to go Chuck Willie! I mean Willie Chuck! I mean Wuck!

I am outta here!

Just got back from doing a repair and got caught up on this post. Look's like that ad really stirred up the hornet's nest. It wasn't me I swear. It was "Ole Willie". :laugh:

I didn't know it but the guy had some other roof repairs that needed done in addition to the two power fans that weren't working. Ended up selling him those repairs as well and did all of it today. The whole thing took about 6 hrs and I made about the same thing I would have made sub-contracting tears offs from some jack-o-lantern in a weeks time. :huh:

I used to do pretty well at sub-contracting tear offs back in the day but I was young, high strung and could nail 15-25 squares a day by hand. 27 2/3 sq. on a government apartment job was the best day I ever had but those days are long gone. If I got 8-10 put on these days I'd probably pass out as soon as I got home. :unsure:

Lefty Said:

twill59 Said: Heres a question Id like to pose to you Lefty. As this might address the divide here:

The divide is you are trying to fit your business into what I am saying and you can not. I can no longer fit that model either.

All my guys have paid holidays, paid vacation, health insurance, retirement which I match 3%, steady year round work - no layoffs, and training.

So I know how to build both business models.

The shingles cost $100.

So you don't want to answer That's up to you.

(EDITED OUT) "The shingles cost $100"

See ya in the funny papers!

wywoody Said: How much is a three year warranty worth from a migrating sub crew? They might as well make it 20 years and really impress the customer.

:laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:

These marketing companies "build their business" not through workmanship but door knockers. They call the kids "salesmen" or sales ladies. None having a clue as to what they are selling to the customer.

They are knocking on the door about getting some insurance money. THAT they do know :side:

B) :(

How much is a three year warranty worth from a migrating sub crew? They might as well make it 20 years and really impress the customer.

In my opinion.....

Everyone's so caught-up/"tolerant" of this whole pseudo-subcontracting thing.

Imagine, (if you will), if a contractor could not "subcontract" his own specialty trade?

The very notion of it, is simply a tactic to undermine/escape paying appropriate labor burdens.

PLAIN & SIMPLE!

WHY THE H-E- dbl hockey sticks, do you think the "pay" is just about at direct labor rates?

We all know a guy, ("business), cannot operate on the prices somewhat industry-set currently.

In states w/o licensing this is the status quo, (that is FACT - not opinion)

twill59 Said: Heres a question Id like to pose to you Lefty. As this might address the divide here:

The divide is you are trying to fit your business into what I am saying and you can not. I can no longer fit that model either.

All my guys have paid holidays, paid vacation, health insurance, retirement which I match 3%, steady year round work - no layoffs, and training.

So I know how to build both business models.

The shingles cost $100.

twill59 Said: One man 10 sq off/ on everyday? With clean up and set up? 14 hr workdays? I dont actually remember my production back in the day. But it did include a helper. Ive done a few roof s by myself. Easy ones, like under 25 sq ranches.

That is 20 sq. 10sq a day. 5 on - 5 off. 10 off and preped one day. Shingle 10 the next day.

I have done plenty of jack jobs by myself. My wife would help me jockey the dump around at night. Materials always delivered roof top. Always threw shingles down never carried them up.

Kick me if I am getting too old for this, but didn't I say a few pages back that the only one making any money off from this is the company that sold it? By a factor of 4 or 5?

Hey, it is tough to get someone to sell their soul. Chuck, I think you have the right idea. Work by YOURSELF, do the work YOURSELF, figure the work YOURSELF, Get paid by the building owner AT THE END OF THE DAY, and let your work sell your work.

One last thing, don't "answer" ads for subcontractors any more than you would for the ads that come on your computer saying "dearest, I am Samuel from Uganda and I want to send you $15,000,000...." Sheesh!

Here's a question I'd like to pose to you Lefty. As this might address the divide here:

If I got a shingle roofing job to do in LeHigh Valley, PA, and I wanted to sub it, how much would Holencik charge per square to the job?

No travel. Minimum specs. One layer, off/on a few vents, 2 valleys. Metal edging, pipe boots. No flashing. No dormers, dumpster or materials.

I'll go 1st: I'd be at $100 minimum. If someone had dozens of these, of course it would be a little less.

Working like that at 46 yrs old, I think I would be dead within a few years. Another reason I chose repair work in addition to what I stated in my last reply.

I gotta head out to Homo Depot, pick up two power fans and install for this nice gentleman. You guys have a great day. I'll be back on later, after I spend the next few hours making Three days sub pay. Half of that will be traveling to/from the job and picking up supplies. Peace out!

One man 10 sq off/ on everyday? With clean up and set up? 14 hr workdays? I don't actually remember my production back in the day. But it did include a helper.

I've done a few roofs by myself. Easy ones, like under 25 sq ranches.