I am done........

After a recent hail storm outside of New Orleans last spring ive had enough waiting on ins to release depreciations and mortage companys to release checks.We are now expected to carry these jobs,was taking an average of 3 to 4 months to close these jobs.It was a joke,we stayed on the phones with lying adjusters and crooked mortage companys.Exactaware had pricing so low you couldnt make shit!Had an Allstate adjuster tell us to roof and then ignored us after we did and it was a 75 square custom home cut up and steep.Had canvas awning we had to removed to roof,eagle view was showing the nieghbors house and she new it.She claimed she left the area and would get back with us, we finally went above her and it pissed her off.Like me waiting to get my money for months didnt piss me off.The only ones that made money were the supply companys,i called exactaware and told them thier pricing was incorrect and they tried to bullchit me with thier going rate!

Self imposed starvation, Tom. A race to the bottom. I heard that Wally World is trying to make changes. Their business model was to be cheapest and now they can't go any lower to make a profit.

right on tinner. But like I have said, these guys are starving already ....... until the ins. co. comes to town.......... and then.... " like, wow man, $220 per sq., really? I'LL BE RICH BABY!!!!!!!!!"

twill59 Said: I like that Chuck. However, in IN I dont see the HOs giving a crap and ultimately what I have heard back from Ins. Cos. is this: We Pay what we pay. End of discussion.

One time I had a customer fight hard. He wanted the job to get done. he was a former county commissioner. Not at all clueless as to what things cost.

Ins. Co. would not come off their pricing. Period.

I admit thst I dont know the next step. What to do.....

(NOC?)

The contractors are causing the problems. If every contractor say "We charge what we charge." End of discussion.

If every one charged $500. per sq., that's what the Ins. Co. will pay. Period.

I see. There is always the risk of a lien being placed by an unpaid sub or supplier. I think I've had maybe 2 customers require waivers at the end of a job (besides builders)

N.O.C Notice of Commencement.http://cache.trustedpartner.com/docs/library/TownofPalmBeachShores2010/Content/TownHall/Notice_of_Commencement_form_59.pdf A Notice of Commencement is a recorded statement executed by the owner. The Notice of Commencement identifies the name and address of the owner and requires that all persons that furnish labor and materials to send a Notice to Owner. By recording a Notice of Commencement, the owner can require the general contractor to supply releases of lien from all persons that have served a "Notice to Owner." Construction must be commenced within ninety (90) days from the date that the Notice of Commencement had been recorded. The Notice of Commencement is effective for one (1) year after it is recorded unless otherwise provided in the Notice.

To the extent that a recorded Notice of Commencement is not posted on the job site by the owner, the municipal building department that issued a building permit, may not approve the first inspection which occurs seven (7) days after the building permit is issued. In the event a construction loan exists, a lender must, prior to disbursement of any construction funds to the contractor, record a Notice of Commencement with the clerk's office. The failure of a lender to record a Notice of Commencement renders the lender liable to the owner for all damages sustained by the owner as a result of the failure to record it. Liability may result to the owner if construction funds are disbursed to the contractor and a subcontractor is owed money. If a Notice of Commencement was recorded, the lender and owner would have received a "Notice to Owner" from that subcontractor. Consequently, the lender would not have disbursed funds to the contractor without first acquiring a release of lien from the subcontractor. Absent a Notice of Commencement, the owner may end up paying twice for the same work; once to the contractor and thereafter to the subcontractor to satisfy its Claim of Lien. B) :) :) B) Deep Down In Florida Where The Sun Shines Damn Near Every Day

I like that Chuck. However, in IN I don't see the HO's giving a crap and ultimately what I have heard back from Ins. Cos. is this: We Pay what we pay. End of discussion.

One time I had a customer fight hard. He wanted the job to get done. he was a former county commissioner. Not at all clueless as to what things cost.

Ins. Co. would not come off their pricing. Period.

I admit thst I don't know the next step. What to do.....

(NOC?)

The point that is being missed, The H/O is paying the bill and has the rght to decide whomever does the roof. H/O decide to file the claim. H/O makes themselves available to the contractor and adjuster. H/O allows each to enter their private property. H/O and contractor sign the contract not the insurance company If you sell the H/O they sign next to you,the insurance company doesn't have a line to sign on any of my roofing contracts how about yours. Get the NOC signed by H/O and notirize, permits filed and get to work asap. Everyone says it is the insurance company. Not to put to fine a point on it. The H/O controls . B) :) :) B) Deep Down In Florida Where The Sun Shines Damn Near Every Day

On some jobs I do make money Randy. Others are a waste of time. Insurance is based on underinsured contractors using illegal or under insured subs.

Legit roofing contractors are priced out of the game mostly. Not saying that money cannot be made on some jobs, but definitely not all.

My work prices out for over $400 sq in Indiana, counting extras. Not selling it for that, but when all is said and done that is what it costs.

Had a conversation w/ a shingle rep. One of his "Gold Star" Contractors was pricing a job against me using subs @ $285 per sq. The job was easily worth $350....easily. He suggested that the $285 was a real good price. I said "Yeah, in 1997".

No one gets it, it seems. But we are definitely in the midst of a big squeeze.

Ins. pricing that I see is south of $300 per sq.

I have never understood how some of you guys can't make money on what insurance pays...how do you sell a homeowner a roof for $500 a square?

I regularly talk with contractors from across the country who pose similar questions. There is one and only one way to do insurance work if one wants to achieve the best results and the highest profits. With the proper presentation, the majority of people a trained and certified contractor talks with will sign their contingency agreement that legally obligates the contractor to the customer and the customer to the contractor.

Most contractors only claim they are "insurance claim specialists" but don't or can't back up the claim. Introduce yourself to the potential customer and show your credentials that prove you really are an insurance claim specialist. Have them read your materials while you inspect their property. Go back and clarify what your materials say, give them an overview of how the process works, why they need you as opposed to a thousand others only making the "specialist" claim, what usually happens if they don't contract with a real specialist and you should have them asking for your pen and wanting to know where to sign.

In a storm situation, there are usually more than enough potential customers to go around for all the locals. Unfortunately, most local contractors, although they may have run a few successful insurance covered storm damage repair jobs (probably for less than full RTA)do not know the process as well as the so-called "chasers" who come in and sweep up a good portion of the work. Many of the "chasers" place ad's for locals to go knock on doors but many of them know less than the local contractors and/or their sales reps. However, because the "chasers" have their marketing down, they are still able to come into anytown, USA and take the work the locals should be able to contract.

Not a complicated process - if a person takes the time and makes the investment in themselves to learn the process the right way.

This is what I used to send my potential customers to and where my contractor customers send their customers to for third party support.

http://www.burcos.com/recover.htm

frank :laugh:

We both know if these fellas had not handed their businesses over to the insurance companies in the 1st place, they would not be here fighting for crumbs and dealing w/ the headaches.

"Your estimate should simply be... "I will do the work for insurance proceeds." The cost to the homeowner, regardless of the amount of the final claim, is their deductible."

No. " I will do the work for my contract price, irregardless of the low payment you're getting from the Ins. Co. They don't set my price. I do. :)

If you run into any situation where you have a signed contract with the customer and you hear, "There are other contractors that will do it for what I am writing it for." or "I will just have to refer the h/o to another contractor.", politely inform the adjuster that it is "tortious interference with a contract". That is illegal.

If you are getting this on a daily basis, you may want to change the way you communicate with the homeowner. Let them know up front that it may happen, and that the proper response is simply, "No these people are my contractor of choice." That is the conversation ending right there...

I would suggest that if the customer is being abused by the adjuster like that, a call to his or her personal agent is in line. I know mine, and I have done business with him for years. The last thing he wants from me is a call saying that his service sucks...

There are plenty of other routes to go before getting a lawyer involved, including, if it a repeat offender... sending a letter to the State Insurance Commissioner.(copied of course to the H/O, adjuster, and ins. company.

Estimators on Call Said: If you arent required by law to give an actual numbers estimate, why are you?

Here is what I would suggest...

Get a contingency contract drafted by a lawyer. In the contract, give them 3 day recision rights. Your contract with them is that you will do the roof for insurance proceeds. In that contract you want to make sure that the customer understands that by doing it for the proceeds that means anything you can collect from the insurance company plus their deductable.

You also need to have in the contract something written in (again if your state laws allow it) that allows you to speak with the insurance company in behalf of the customer.

Dont do any work on that job until the 3 days are over. Dont even open a file in the office.

Once that 3 days is up, get the adjuster scope, and immediately put in for all of the things the adjuster left off. (there will be thousands of dollars worth of items.) Call the adjuster and get a revised estimate from them, order the permit, and then get product delivered.

If the adjuster shows up with a different contractor, or suggests to the homeowner to find someone else after that initial 3 days, go back to the lawyer and sue them for interference with a contract. You will lock in more jobs and get paid faster. We write Xactimate estimates all day for people all over the nation that do this exact same thing.

Have any of you ever filed suit for this? It happens to us on a daily basis. We get calls from H/O's all the time that are mad because after everything is fine, the adjuster calls and tells them not to work with us because we use xm8 pricing and go after all scope items. It is definately something we would like to pursue. Thank you in advance for the advice and experiences.